PS3 Hacked

YDL running on the Sony Playstation 3

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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby ppietro » 27 Jan 2010, 01:56

billb wrote:As of now it's available for download, but there's more to it than just software ... don't think I'll be trying that one myself. :wink:


Also - to note:

1. Requires PS3 FAT, due to OtherOS portion
2. This code has only been tested with Firmware 2.4.2.

Cheers,
Paul
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby beryl _ps3_compiz » 27 Jan 2010, 10:25

So what does this code do, not that I can make head nor tail of it. So really he never hacked the ps3 fully just at a low level from what I am reading. So with this code what can one do with it to make things better any ideas people. :?: :?: :?: :?:

Thanks,

Thomas
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby oeboeroe » 27 Jan 2010, 17:22

ppietro wrote:
Correct. At this point, he doesn't see a need to release the hack, since, apparently, certain parts of the hypervisor can be accessed directly from OtherOS. To paraphrase what he's said, "It doesn't appear that 3D graphics are actually locked out because of the hypervisor - there just isn't a driver for them. If somebody who can write 3D drivers shows me the block, and needs the hack, I will provide them with the exploit."

Cheers,
Paul


ppietro wrote:Also - to note:

1. Requires PS3 FAT, due to OtherOS portion
2. This code has only been tested with Firmware 2.4.2.

Cheers,
Paul



This is nothing new, certain firmwares let you use the RGX it was patched out. did he confirm het was using 3.15 on a phat..

At least it must be a fat (see bd-drive and otheros comments).

And if he has been playing the otheros option, he's just exploring.. he said he dumped the brain but has not shown any reverse engineering skills. Reading IBM's secure platform regarding cell b.e. I can't see sony not using this to ensure the copyright restrictions mandatory for content delivery (games or other).

Owh and in regards to my prior remark concerning DMCA, he's not even close.. I can't see that this HW trick to trigger this 'error' condition let's you get to the goods.. SELF..
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby beryl _ps3_compiz » 27 Jan 2010, 17:38

Dam, thats it I'm not holding out for a hack on ps3 all i wanted it for was compiz fusion, now i'm just going to get a PC pay day tomorrow. I will download Linux from the web install configure and update. Just one question what linux disto do you think I should go for, It took me a week to config ydl 6.2 install was not a problem, I was new to it. I set up the repo's and installed and config the software works great now. Any ideas on a disto people :)

Thanks,

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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby ppietro » 27 Jan 2010, 18:41

oeboeroe wrote:
ppietro wrote:1. Requires PS3 FAT, due to OtherOS portion
2. This code has only been tested with Firmware 2.4.2.


This is nothing new, certain firmwares let you use the RGX it was patched out. did he confirm het was using 3.15 on a phat..


No - he was using 2.4.2. There's no guarantee this will work with 3.15, although he thinks it probably should.

Since he's using OtherOS, it's definitely a Phat, so there's no guarantee this will work on a slim either.

Clever hack, to be sure - I took a look at it - but it still doesn't get around the "Hardware Root Of Secrecy" that is running on an isolated SPE. Geohot can't "break" this, since it's in hardware on the Cell itself - he can only kick the SPE out, thus losing the root key, if I understand the architecture correctly.

You should definitely read this:
http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/power ... lsecurity/
to see what challenges lie ahead.

beryl _ps3_compiz wrote:Dam, thats it I'm not holding out for a hack on ps3 all i wanted it for was compiz fusion, now i'm just going to get a PC pay day tomorrow.


I think we've been trying to tell you that it wasn't possible on a PS3. :P

beryl _ps3_compiz wrote:I will download Linux from the web install configure and update. Just one question what linux disto do you think I should go for, It took me a week to config ydl 6.2 install was not a problem, I was new to it. I set up the repo's and installed and config the software works great now. Any ideas on a disto people


If you're used to YDL, you might like Fedora. Ubuntu is based on a slightly different version of Linux called Debian. It's not totally different, but it's not the same either. If you want the exact YDL experience, you can try CentOS, since YDL is based on it. However - if you're starting from scratch, you'll probably find Fedora to be a better fit, since it's cutting edge and would support things like compiz & beryl.

Quick explanation. Red Hat Linux split into two versions - Red Hat Enterprise Linux (RHEL) & Fedora. Fedora has the new code for the developers, RHEL has the stable code for businesses. Fedora is free. RHEL is not free, however, the source code is. A group of folks take the free source code, remove the copyrighted logos, and compile it as CentOS. RHEL tends to lag Fedora by about three versions:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhel#Relat ... tributions
YDL is based on RHEL, via CentOS.

Cheers,
Paul
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby beryl _ps3_compiz » 27 Jan 2010, 18:55

Hello Paul,

Thanks for all the help, I think you finally got me, I'm going for the PC with the KMV switch. I will continue to run ydl 6.2 on the ps3 for testing and things. Great form you have here and got alot of help from it :)

Regards,

Thomas
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby oeboeroe » 27 Jan 2010, 19:37

All I can say is, you could appeal to your vendor to supply a datasheet for a developer to use when implementing a driver. Since both ATI and NVIDIA currently have problems facing other peoples IP regarding their GPU's drivers. This has been the "battle" between the giants regarding the PC games market, FUD plus specific game optimization regardless of the underlying libraries, it beeing opengl or directx.

There is some hope concerning ATI, since AMD has been trying to open up their driver for foss.

Then again I won't be troubled if I could CUDA my way on the RGX, don't need no 3d..

smashing the vizor for fun and profit is cool, just hope there's some common sense before someplace starts shipping chips again and you'd be fighting a challenger on grand turismo you'll never beat. E.g. I don't want to give up my gameos just so I can run eye candy on a workstation.

If you want compiz like ability try looking/supporting the effort to get the CELL to act as a GPU, specs are available a FOSS driver is available. Someone just needs some time to get it up and running again..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallium3D

http://www.yellowdog-board.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7053#p35823

If there is enough time.. one could even opt to GSOC it.. I don't know just winging it here.

There are even tutorials (FOSS) out there how one creates a raytracer on the CELL..

DOOM raytraced anyone?

Just my 2 euro cents
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby ppietro » 27 Jan 2010, 19:49

oeboeroe wrote:Then again I won't be troubled if I could CUDA my way on the RGX, don't need no 3d..


Unfortunately, probably not.

The RSX is considered to be equivalent to an nVidia 7800:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RSX_%27Rea ... hesizer%27

CUDA didn't start until nVidia 8xxx or so:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CUDA

Conjecture on my part, since I can't look at the RSX directly - :D - but it would seem no CUDA available.

Cheers,
Paul
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby oeboeroe » 27 Jan 2010, 19:56

ppietro wrote:
oeboeroe wrote:Then again I won't be troubled if I could CUDA my way on the RGX, don't need no 3d..


Unfortunately, probably not.

The RSX is considered to be equivalent to an nVidia 7800:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RSX_%27Rea ... hesizer%27

CUDA didn't start until nVidia 8xxx or so:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CUDA

Conjecture on my part, since I can't look at the RSX directly - :D - but it would seem no CUDA available.

Cheers,
Paul


Darn it!

http://www.nvidia.com/content/cudazone/CUDABrowser/assets/data/applications.xml

This is such awesome stuff and within reach of anyone if enough passion is applied.

Then again there seems to be some competition:
http://forums.nvidia.com/lofiversion/index.php?t58846.html

If you want to talk with some cell-masters, try fixstars ;)
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby sirgrinalot » 16 Feb 2010, 08:13

I thought this was interesting supposedly sony has filed a patent regarding keys after geohot claimed the other day the ps3 is now 100% fully hacked with the help of the community, which is funny because that is the second time he has claimed it is fully hacked.

here is the article:

http://www.qj.net/qjnet/playstation-3/sony-responds-to-geohotz-ps3-exploit-with-a-new-patent.html

Edit: here is the alleged patent "published by a sony employee"

http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20100037068#ixzz0feEg2cT4
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby billb » 18 Feb 2010, 06:37

Not sure how this topic went so far astray, but I've split the last 23 posts or so into a new one here:

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=7136
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby Legendary_Agent » 18 Feb 2010, 08:12

i want to apologize for the long off topic chat, i started it and im sorry for that.
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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby dan_f14 » 22 Feb 2010, 13:49

Just so I can be clear in the possible direction of this hack. What I want basically is access to the graphics card. I currently have an old xbox thats been hacked to run XBMC. I would like to run the linux version of XBMC on my PS3 but I understand that to run it the PS3 needs 2d and 3d hardware acceleration. From what I understand about this hack he can kick out the spu that handles the security (7th SPU?) and thereby gain access to the system as its no longer restricted by the hypervisor? I may be wrong but that is what I understand of it, please correct me if I am wrong. Now what I am confused about is that from what I have read geohot does not think the Hypervisor restricts access to the RSX which is what I believed it did. Instead from what I understand he states it just doesn't have a linux driver. If thats true do we need the hack to enable the the RSX? Should someone skilled enough create a driver for the RSX would we need the hack at all? Also I believe the RSX is a customised Nvidia 7800 (by customised I mean configured for console use) and I'm assuming on such an old graphics card that there will be a pretty decent linux driver out there for it. If everything I have said is true how easy would it be to write an RSX driver using the 7800 driver as a start point?

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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby ppietro » 22 Feb 2010, 19:58

dan_f14 wrote:Now what I am confused about is that from what I have read geohot does not think the Hypervisor restricts access to the RSX which is what I believed it did. Instead from what I understand he states it just doesn't have a linux driver. If thats true do we need the hack to enable the the RSX?


That's about the summary of Geohot's thinking right there. Unfortunately, there is some question as to its validity. In a comment to one of Geohot's blog posts, we get this:

Geohot: "I'm not even sure I believe that the HV restricts video card access, just that the OtherOS driver is 2D."

Hard to prove a negative without looking at all the protected code but a lot time has been spent trying to get to it. It was possible to get to the push buffer before FW 2.1 where that possibility was patched away, so it is assumed Sony is at least trying very hard do deny us RSX access. Check the "hunt for HV's FIFO/Push buffer" thread on ps2dev.



In summation: He thinks it's possible to access the RSX's 3D from the hypervisor, but the folks trying to do this say it doesn't work.

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Re: PS3 Hacked

Postby dan_f14 » 22 Feb 2010, 23:27

Is it possible that something other than the Hypervisor is restricting access to the RSX? Assuming both parties are telling the truth it seems to me the only possibility.

Also when gehot says
Geohot: "I'm not even sure I believe that the HV restricts video card access, just that the OtherOS driver is 2D."
is he stating that linux has a 2d driver for rsx? I thought the Cell processor did all the graphics and thats why linux does runs a little slow on the ps3?
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